Fight 105

Tenjo Tenge: Where the boys are bad, and the girls are badder.

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Post by kk1 » Fri Jun 01, 2007 1:02 pm

Strangler wrote:Thanks Fugu.

There is the confirmation the "genius" was Ichyou. Kabane talked about "true nature of its blade"...

Interesting for the following.
The picture of him with his name wasn't confirmation enough...? :roll:

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Post by kk1 » Fri Jun 01, 2007 1:02 pm

Dgames wrote:2 month for the next fight?? don't they think a month wait is to long and they make it even bigger??? Hope OG gives a long fight next month :)
It should be the start of a new volume so we should get some nice color pages too :D

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Post by kk1 » Fri Jun 01, 2007 2:34 pm

FuguTabetai wrote:my translation is up in the usual place for the impatient.
Great job Fugu. Wow for once a completely straightforward chapter, Souhaku's plan finally clearly laid out. Dougen's and Mitsuomi's (is that the real Mits or Shyoujyou?) relationship still seems a bit odd though. And we learn why they didn't just poke Souhaku's eye out. Great finish to this volume and great set up to the start of the next volume Aya vs Kabane, the dragon eye vs the dragon...? Hmm Kabane even hints there's something more to his "swords", looks like we'll get me and Mr P's argument settled 8)

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Post by Strangler » Fri Jun 01, 2007 3:43 pm

kk1 wrote:
The picture of him with his name wasn't confirmation enough...? :roll:
Well, if you want to be cheeky, yes, it was certainely enough.
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Post by Dgames » Fri Jun 01, 2007 7:37 pm

kabane power is dragon sword right?

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Maya

Post by pintudao » Fri Jun 01, 2007 7:52 pm

How many months has it been since we last saw Maya? I am really looking forward to seeing her leaving that hospital and enntering the tournament...

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Post by Dgames » Fri Jun 01, 2007 8:33 pm

next volume i think she will come bak asshat had his last fight so juken club have 4 member so they need maya to come bak if they want to keep in the tornament :P

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Post by kk1 » Sat Jun 02, 2007 1:10 am

Dgames wrote:kabane power is dragon sword right?
Read last chapters thread for a discussion of Kabane's power :wink:

And as of yet it has never been named as "dragon..." anything. The Kabane branch family's power is the "dragon claw". All we know is big swords appear and he can cut things, notice we never see the "swords" actually cut anything though. I guess we'll have to wait to see what their "true nature" is.

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Post by kk1 » Sat Jun 02, 2007 1:16 am

Dgames wrote:next volume i think she will come bak asshat had his last fight so juken club have 4 member so they need maya to come bak if they want to keep in the tornament :P
No they don't. 1)Nagi 2) Bob 3)Masataka 4) Kurei 5) Aya 6)Asshat use the fingers on your other hand and you can count past 5 :wink:

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Re: Maya

Post by kk1 » Sat Jun 02, 2007 1:22 am

pintudao wrote:How many months has it been since we last saw Maya? I am really looking forward to seeing her leaving that hospital and enntering the tournament...
7 fight 98, that was probably the first volume she hasn't been in. sad :cry: and I really don't expect to see again for awhile.

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Post by Dgames » Sat Jun 02, 2007 4:24 am

kk1 wrote:
Dgames wrote:next volume i think she will come bak asshat had his last fight so juken club have 4 member so they need maya to come bak if they want to keep in the tornament :P
No they don't. 1)Nagi 2) Bob 3)Masataka 4) Kurei 5) Aya 6)Asshat use the fingers on your other hand and you can count past 5 :wink:
this is asshat last match his arm won't recover soon so u can count 5 members can kurei fight?? i don't think he can so they have 4 members. Nagi can't fight either remember what kabane in this fight "what will happen if ... the *current* Souichirou- sama devours any more "Ki"blablabla souhaku "he will be able to use all of the "power" that is within the body of the demon exorcist ..." so count 3 members able to fight so Maya really needs to return on next volume

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Post by Swordfish II » Sat Jun 02, 2007 2:45 pm

FuguTabetai wrote:my translation is up in the usual place for the impatient.
Many thanks as always, fugu.

I apologize for my inability to find your translation for chapter 105. I have scanned and searched this site and cannot locate where this is stored. Could someone please post a link? I would really appreciate it.

Thanks,

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Post by Dgames » Sat Jun 02, 2007 3:21 pm

Swordfish II wrote:
FuguTabetai wrote:my translation is up in the usual place for the impatient.
Many thanks as always, fugu.

I apologize for my inability to find your translation for chapter 105. I have scanned and searched this site and cannot locate where this is stored. Could someone please post a link? I would really appreciate it.

Thanks,

SF2
this is the link for the translation http://tjtg.mangatranslation.com/TJTG_17_Trans.html is on the bottom of the site

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Post by IAS » Sat Jun 02, 2007 7:41 pm

As much as i woud like to see Maya return i really doubt she will appear again before the final clash. I her actual condition you coud say she's dead and the only one been able to bring her back is Sohaku or perhaps after the battle Nagi, how knows...
The club can still be on the tournamente if they have 5 people in the record, regardless if the can fight or not.
Rereading the past arc a remember some character very important charater that i had forgotten, Sen hime the bearer of amaterasu's gate... and i wonder if in the present time there woud been someone with that power woud it be able for example to cure Mitsuomi by reverting the ki flow that Shin had infused on him?
If Sohaku is trying to recreate the scence of Susano, and there is someone with Amaterasu's "power" (wich is neutralization), then if someone with Tsukuyomi's "power" exist, will it be amplification?
There is an obvius relation between TT and japanese myth, thing is i can't apply it to the present time...

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Post by DemonNeedle » Sat Jun 02, 2007 9:31 pm

They don't need maya for a fifth person really. Like in the Shin Arc, Asshat was just there to fill the fifth slot while everyone else took care of the fighting. Alien is probably going to just stay out of the fighting and let the others handle it.
If Aya gets back to her team, she'll probably try to keep Soichirou from fighting and will probably have herself with Masataka and Bob fight from now on.
I don't see Maya coming back to the fights untillike the finals, the earliest. If that's the case, then I don't think Nagi is going to fight any more until the finals, where everyone is there, including his mother and the father/son spear clan.

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Post by Kyu1982 » Sun Jun 03, 2007 1:20 am

IAS wrote: If Sohaku is trying to recreate the scence of Susano, and there is someone with Amaterasu's "power" (wich is neutralization), then if someone with Tsukuyomi's "power" exist, will it be amplification?
There is an obvius relation between TT and japanese myth, thing is i can't apply it to the present time...
I think Sohaku finished his work of creating Susanao.
But, you are going too far. Tsukiyomi did not get introduced at this point.
My wild guess is that Tsukiyomi has no power at all.
Susanao= Special power
Amaterasu = Neutralization
Tsukiyomi = Regular human.
Amaterasu is counter part of Susanao.
But, Tsukiyomi does not have any thing opposing him, so my guess is that he is normal human. Better yet, I think Tsukiyomi might be the ancester of Takayanagi family. We have no idea why other 12 families see Takayanagi family as their superior when they have no special power, and they were not some kind of Daimyo (war lord) in War era.
So, my prediction is that Takayanagi belong to Tsukiyomi line if Tsukiyomi was regular human.

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Post by Swordfish II » Sun Jun 03, 2007 1:11 pm

Dgames wrote:this is the link for the translation http://tjtg.mangatranslation.com/TJTG_17_Trans.html
Many thanks! Yes, this chapter does confirm many interpretations that have been discussed here, and adds a few new ones, such as Nokimi hosting a "mother worm". Yick!
IAS wrote: Rereading the past arc a remember some character very important charater that i had forgotten, Senhime the bearer of amaterasu's gate... and i wonder if in the present time there woud been someone with that power woud it be able for example to cure Mitsuomi by reverting the ki flow that Shin had infused on him?
That is a very interesting idea. Maybe Oh!Great hasn't thought of that. Could be that Mitsoumi has been injuried for so long now he's past the point of no return. Or maybe we can get the Hotaru clan to use their Dragon palm on him after they restore Maya to health. :wink:
Kyu1982 wrote: I think Sohaku finished his work of creating Susanao.
But, you are going too far. Tsukiyomi did not get introduced at this point.
My wild guess is that Tsukiyomi has no power at all.
Susanao= Special power
Amaterasu = Neutralization
Tsukiyomi = Regular human.
Amaterasu is counter part of Susanao.
Pardon my asking, and my apologies for not knowing this already, but I cannot place the names "Susanao" (I take this to be the "Gaokishi Takehaya Susano Onomikoto" mentioned by Souhaku in ch. 105) and "Tsukiyomi". These are characters in the story? I ask this because I am (slowly!) working on revisions to the TT character list and I could not find them there. If they are missing I would like to add them.

As always, thanks to everyone for your insights!

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Post by kujoe » Sun Jun 03, 2007 6:42 pm

They really aren't actual characters in the story. (Well, they could...)

However, they originally belong in Japanese mythology and are being figuratively referred to in the manga as the author sees fit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susanoo

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Post by Swordfish II » Mon Jun 04, 2007 8:59 am

kk1 wrote:
Dgames wrote:kabane power is dragon sword right?
Read last chapters thread for a discussion of Kabane's power :wink:

And as of yet it has never been named as "dragon..." anything. The Kabane branch family's power is the "dragon claw". All we know is big swords appear and he can cut things, notice we never see the "swords" actually cut anything though. I guess we'll have to wait to see what their "true nature" is.
The "Dragon's Claw" is a power of the Tsumuji clan, not Kabane, isn't it? As you say, the Kabane family's "flying swords" power has not really been named, although 400 years ago Kabane Myouun referred to them as the "Swords of the Bodhisvatta". And yes, I'm quite curious as to what the "true nature" of Kabane's swords is -- he seemed quite nervous about Aya seeing that, and personally, I can't figure out what it might be. They appear out of nowhere, if they can be seen at all. They cut through anything. They are controlled to a microscopic degree. But Aya managed to shatter them all, although no peices are seen on the ground afterwards. Very strange!
kujoe wrote:They really aren't actual characters in the story. (Well, they could...)

However, they originally belong in Japanese mythology and are being figuratively referred to in the manga as the author sees fit.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Susanoo
Many thanks for the clarifications. I am finding TT to be a very fun and challenging way to learn things about Japanese history, legend and folklore! :)

By the way, TT 105 is available on stoptazmo, although the server seems to be incredibly busy right now. Can't imagine why!

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Post by Strangler » Mon Jun 04, 2007 10:13 am

kk1 wrote:
Dgames wrote:kabane power is dragon sword right?
notice we never see the "swords" actually cut anything though.
In the past arc, Kabane beheaded Ono Jirou with one of them.

But it's fairly possible most are illusions, for an exemple.
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Post by kk1 » Mon Jun 04, 2007 1:09 pm

Swordfish II wrote:
kk1 wrote:
Dgames wrote:kabane power is dragon sword right?
Read last chapters thread for a discussion of Kabane's power :wink:

And as of yet it has never been named as "dragon..." anything. The Kabane branch family's power is the "dragon claw". All we know is big swords appear and he can cut things, notice we never see the "swords" actually cut anything though. I guess we'll have to wait to see what their "true nature" is.
The "Dragon's Claw" is a power of the Tsumuji clan, not Kabane, isn't it? !
Reread it I said branch family.

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Post by kk1 » Mon Jun 04, 2007 1:11 pm

Strangler wrote:
kk1 wrote:
Dgames wrote:kabane power is dragon sword right?
notice we never see the "swords" actually cut anything though.
In the past arc, Kabane beheaded Ono Jirou with one of them.

But it's fairly possible most are illusions, for an exemple.
We don't actually see it though. That's what I'm guessing the visble swords are just illusions, but what's the point when he can still cut stuff anyway?

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Post by IAS » Mon Jun 04, 2007 1:35 pm

But Aya managed to shatter them all, although no peices are seen on the ground afterwards. Very strange!
In her time travel she saw through Kabane's technique, so assume she knows it's weakpoints, or at least a way to counter it...

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Post by Strangler » Mon Jun 04, 2007 1:58 pm

kk1 wrote:
Strangler wrote:
kk1 wrote: notice we never see the "swords" actually cut anything though.
In the past arc, Kabane beheaded Ono Jirou with one of them.

But it's fairly possible most are illusions, for an exemple.
We don't actually see it though. That's what I'm guessing the visble swords are just illusions, but what's the point when he can still cut stuff anyway?
There might be something interesting to guess. The visible ones are illusion and there might be one who is invisible but not an illusion.
But Kabane (young) would not be that upset when Aya broke them.

The blades must not be then just illusion, but they might have a strong weakness.
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Post by Swordfish II » Mon Jun 04, 2007 6:21 pm

kk1 wrote:
Swordfish II wrote:
The "Dragon's Claw" is a power of the Tsumuji clan, not Kabane, isn't it? !
Reread it I said branch family.
Ah, I get it now -- after some research I see you are referring to the Shyukyou family. I recall now that the Tsumuji are White Feathers. Thank you.

I wonder -- is there a TT "family tree" out on the web somewhere? I have searched but not found anything comprehensive. It sure would be a handy thing...

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Post by FuguTabetai » Mon Jun 04, 2007 8:35 pm

Swordfish II wrote: I wonder -- is there a TT "family tree" out on the web somewhere? I have searched but not found anything comprehensive. It sure would be a handy thing...
I don't know of any.

If someone wants to write up a simple edge list

PERSON1 PERSON2 relationship

then I can run that through dotty (a graph generation program) to get some charts and stuff.

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Post by Asunder » Wed Jun 06, 2007 12:00 am

In regards to the Kabane power, perhaps the swords are being wielded by invisible deceased members of the family. That would bring it back to the whole death thing and would explain why the current Kabane is confident he's much more powerful than his predecessor.

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Post by kk1 » Wed Jun 06, 2007 3:14 am

Hey Fugu I keep forgetting to ask, what's Nokimi's accent? It seemed she was speaking differently then the typical Tokyo accent.

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Post by FuguTabetai » Wed Jun 06, 2007 7:12 pm

kk1 wrote:Hey Fugu I keep forgetting to ask, what's Nokimi's accent? It seemed she was speaking differently then the typical Tokyo accent.
Nothing that I recognized, but I'm no Japanese linguist, so who knows?

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Post by iijyanaika » Sat Jun 09, 2007 1:33 am

thanks as always for the translation fugu.

i'm glad i'm out of the country while TJTG is on a break. The agony isn't as bad ^o^

people have been talking about maya coming back into the scene, but remember when she used reiki with the help of aya. all that ki she stored was used up. so i HIGHLY doubt she's going to return to fight a serious battle. she'll probably end up dying alongside mitsuomi leaving everything to the younger ones. meh, who knows.

and since we haven't seen her for so long, maybe she'll be apart of the color inserts for the new vol :D looking forward to seeing what this new cover will be like.

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Post by Swordfish II » Wed Jun 13, 2007 4:30 pm

I'd like to mention this, since I haven't seen it previously, about a question we here have dicussed before: Who will end up being the "True Warrior".

I was just re-reading chapter 105, and looking at v17 pg151, where Souhaku is musing about the "Gaokishi Takehaya Susano Onomikoto", it occurs to me that the "True Warrior" is going to be our main bad guy Souhaku himself, in the body of Souichiro. At least, according to Souhaku's plans, where all the Ki devoured by the "Dragon's Fist" will make him so. "The New Warrior will be born here", he says to himself. Of course, those plans may or may not work out...

Also in chapter 105, Dougen chats about the data on the Takayanagi supercomputer-chip, and calls it "The Red Feather Elimination Program". This plan is something originally authored 400 years ago by Kengo Ichiyou Nagi, and, if its name is any indication, would directly counter Souhaku's plans. (It would also fulfill Mitsoumi's plans to make the world safe for people lacking supernormal abilities from those who do.) Does it seem feasible that this is what has motivated Dougen's work for the last eight years, since his friend Natsume was killed by Shin? As we know, that was the time when many aspects of TT seem to have started.

Thoughts? Does this make sense?

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Post by Dgames » Thu Jun 14, 2007 1:45 am

just a question souhako is soposed to have all the others dragon gates on his right eye ??? but i think that is impossible since the only family that can have more than one dragon gate is the nagi family souhako is from the kengo family so i think he can only have one dragon gate his dragon gate and he will have to get the others missing from the ppl that are still alive right??

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Post by kk1 » Thu Jun 14, 2007 2:57 am

Dgames wrote:just a question souhako is soposed to have all the others dragon gates on his right eye ??? but i think that is impossible since the only family that can have more than one dragon gate is the nagi family souhako is from the kengo family so i think he can only have one dragon gate his dragon gate and he will have to get the others missing from the ppl that are still alive right??
No Nagi already has a lot of them on his body which is the body Souhaku will be in.

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Post by IAS » Thu Jun 14, 2007 10:03 pm

As i understand Susano originaly had all the red feather powers within him and then for some reason the gates were split among the actual red feather families. Besides you're refering to Sohaku as a "flesh and bones" been when really he more a kind of entity, that why he is a hard to kill bastard...
Kengo Nagi knew that he coud not openly oposse Sohaku (at that time he was the Shogun) and knew that Sohaku was planning to resurrect Susano (meaning someone with every "red gate" in his body), so he has only one option: if he can't wipe out Sohaku then he will crush his needs, the red feather. This was a weird move, him been a red feahter "hunting" others like him, indirect but at same time direct... don't know, in my opinion Kengo refueled the so called 100 years war.

In posts above a tried to remark the importance of the amaterasu, tsukuyomi characters (even if they have not fully appear) since TT is a mithology based manga. Amaterasu (godess of the sun, neutralization), Tsukuyomi (god of moon, ?) and Susano (god of the sea, red feathers power).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_mythology
(it shoud take you 20 min)

If Sohaku becomes Susano, the only two people able to fight him are amaterasu or tsukuyomi. Kyu1982 believes that the Takayani descent directly from Tsukoyomi (see the post above), wicht i now agree. So one way or another the whole manga climax will come with the death fight between Nagi (Sohaku) and Masataka.

Anyway no chapter this month, next will be around July 15?

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Post by kk1 » Fri Jun 15, 2007 1:21 am

IAS wrote: In posts above a tried to remark the importance of the amaterasu, tsukuyomi characters (even if they have not fully appear) since TT is a mithology based manga. Amaterasu (godess of the sun, neutralization), Tsukuyomi (god of moon, ?) and Susano (god of the sea, red feathers power).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japanese_mythology
(it shoud take you 20 min)

If Sohaku becomes Susano, the only two people able to fight him are amaterasu or tsukuyomi. Kyu1982 believes that the Takayani descent directly from Tsukoyomi (see the post above), wicht i now agree. So one way or another the whole manga climax will come with the death fight between Nagi (Sohaku) and Masataka.

Anyway no chapter this month, next will be around July 15?
The UJ special states the heros of Japanese myth and legend were the ancestors of the Takayanagi family. As you mentioned Ameratsu has already appeared(in the past arc, or her "gate" anyway) Souhaku plans to be Susano, so you're right Tsukoyomi will probably appear but don't jump to any conclusions about who it is, remeber there are many people at the school with powers that haven't awoken yet...just be ready for some surprises. Oh Great! likes surprises :wink:

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Post by DemonNeedle » Fri Jun 15, 2007 3:04 am

I think the Tsukiyomi and Amaterasu refers to Mitsuomi and Maya as the Sun Goddess and Moon God as the Day and night aren't together at the same time refers to their situation. I think that there are so many different myths referenced in here that you can't really tell which way the story is going to go next.

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Post by IAS » Fri Jun 15, 2007 4:30 pm

The UJ special states the heros of Japanese myth and legend were the ancestors of the Takayanagi family
Most of the heroes on the japanese myths descend from one of those 3 gods...

Anyway this has gone way off topic now.

So no chapter this month, will next be around July 15?

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Post by FuguTabetai » Fri Jun 15, 2007 8:06 pm

IAS wrote: So no chapter this month, will next be around July 15?
Probably July 19th.

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Post by kujoe » Sat Jun 16, 2007 4:05 am

I have this funny hunch that Reiki = "Kusanagi" and that Aya will come to wield it one day, especially with all this talk of "becoming the blade for the one important to you" or something like that. That would then mean, Souhaku (inside Souichirou) as "Orochi." So uhm, wait, that means Souichirou is the "princess" or rather, the "prince" in this case.

But that's probably too obvious.

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Post by Kyu1982 » Tue Jun 19, 2007 8:53 am

kujoe wrote:I have this funny hunch that Reiki = "Kusanagi" and that Aya will come to wield it one day, especially with all this talk of "becoming the blade for the one important to you" or something like that. That would then mean, Souhaku (inside Souichirou) as "Orochi." So uhm, wait, that means Souichirou is the "princess" or rather, the "prince" in this case.

But that's probably too obvious.
Well, you are trying to mix it with Japanese myth.
It is not bad, but I don't think it should work that way.
I think Reiki did most of its part at this point.

I think Sohaku was scared of Reiki because it has a power to inform others his secret or perheps it can break his power and kill him besides pokinhg his eye.

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Post by DemonNeedle » Fri Jun 22, 2007 4:13 pm

Well, the thing that hasn't been mentioned is who from the Enforcement Group is going to fight who from the Jyukenbu. Aya is probably going to try her best not to let Souichirou fight anyone or else Souhaku is going to take over. Since Kabane is on the roster, Aya might fight him. But who else is going to fight who? I could actually see Kabane fighting the remaining four from the Jyukenbu (Aya, Nagi, Bob, and Masataka). Any one of those fights would be interesting to see on the big stage.

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