The future for Bob and Bunshichi

EliteF22 · Post by **EliteF22** » Mon Jun 14, 2004 12:48 am

After ch. 74 I kinda feel that Bob is going to go train under Mitsuomi and Bunshichi is going to switch to Jyuukenbu. What are everyone else's thoughts. Also, it's kinda bugging me that know one seems really bothered by Souichirou being kidnapped by his dad.

Post by **FuguTabetai** » Mon Jun 14, 2004 10:39 am

I don't see Bob training under Mitsuomi at all.

Plenty of people are bothered by Nagi being kidnapped. Remember, it has only been like a day since that happened.

Bunshichi does look like he will fight on the side of the Jyuukenbu though.

lost · Post by **lost** » Mon Jun 14, 2004 1:52 pm

I think it's possible Bob being trained under Mitsuomi, because there're times that Bob would think about how far is he from Nagi and the reason of him training most of the time was cause he wanted to catch up to Nagi. In the beginning of the story at the bowling alley he was tempted when Mitsuomi said he wouldn't be able to grow strong enough to beat Nagi or something if he continues to be trained under Natsume.

Also there isn't really a reason why Bob fought for Jyuukenbu either except that he doesn't like Mitsuomi and the enforcement group because of what they did to Chiaki at the beginning, so it's possible that he would quit Jyuukenbu.

I would like to see which side Bunshichi will fight on at the tournament, I've no idea why is he fighting on Mitsuomi side cept for the fact he doesn't wanna fight against him, but if he does, then no one would be fighting for Mitsuomi cept for the F members, which I think only 3 are left with ability to fight, Ishiyumi lost his water bolt ability, Tsumuji is awfully hurt, Madoka might not fight for him and she was only fighting for Souhaku anyway cause she was controlled by him, only 3 F members left and 1 haven't made an appearance yet. The lineup is hard to predict at the moment.

pv82 · Post by **pv82** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 7:31 am

EliteF22 wrote:After ch. 74 I kinda feel that Bob is going to go train under Mitsuomi and Bunshichi is going to switch to Jyuukenbu. What are everyone else's thoughts. Also, it's kinda bugging me that know one seems really bothered by Souichirou being kidnapped by his dad.

Wow, I finally got through. Hey I kinda agree with you on that Bob will train with Mitsuomi. I basing this on what Bob said after his fight with Modoka really doubt himself and his powers. Which is wierd because he finally found his inner voice for fighting, and he put up a decent fight against her. I really don't think he lost the fight, Masataka just happened to be there and I guess saw enough and intervined. It also obvious that Mitsuomi is seduced by BOb's potentional, I don't think he'll be taking NO as an answer anymore. But on the other hand, Bob still hates the Enforcement Group for what happened to Chiaki. So in the end which wieghs more, Becoming a better fighter or Redemption for Chaiki? Love or strenght?

kujoe · Post by **kujoe** » Tue Jun 15, 2004 11:20 am

Although in another thread I said that Bob's chances of joining Mitsuomi are 50-50, I also think that something significant should happen first before Bob makes that choice. At the moment, the closest people that link him to the Jyuukenbu are Chiaki and Souichirou, and as the bowling alley fight has shown (and the aftermath of Ryuuzaki's assault) Chiaki has her own place within the friendship of the three. It's possible for Bob to join Mitsuomi, and he definitely will--if he's got a good reason to. And so far, he really doesn't have any.

burrowowl · Post by **burrowowl** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 2:26 pm

I don't think it's a matter of Mitsuomi being "seduced" by anything. One of the various possible motivations that Mitsuomi has for his actions is to straighten out that mess that the martial arts community has become. Enlisting a talented martial artist to that cause would only be natural. Having Bob killed certainly wouldn't help Mitsuomi in this regard.

Of course, we don't really know what the motivations of most of the main characters are at this point; we just have some limited background information.

User151 · Post by **User151** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 4:33 pm

In the fight 68 & 69 does Bob gain somesort of fighting insight or rythm?
Or is it just Mitsuomi helping him? What bothers me is that why did we see mitsuomi tapping the window during his fight with madoka.

On the thing about Bob joining Mitsuomi, it's very possible. Cos unlike Souichiro who wants to get stronger as well as fight for Maya, Bob is more fixed on becoming stronger. And while Maya is pushing him to build more foundation, he's more keen on doing the real thing (Training & techniques). So if Mitsuomi could giv him some reasonable shortcut he might take it. Remember at the bowling alley, when Mitsuomi invite him to join the Enforcement group, he's was thinking more like "should i join u" instead of "i'll never join a shit-head like u."

But, on the other hand, if Bob realize that all improvements that he got now are because of the foundations that Maya had given him, he might not join Mitsuomi.

As for Bunshichi, he really should go back to Jyuukenbu cos that's where he really belongs. He was the best friend of Shin and in some ways upholder of Justice. he should fight alongside with the Jyuukenbu

Post by **FuguTabetai** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 5:28 pm

User151 wrote:In the fight 68 & 69 does Bob gain somesort of fighting insight or rythm?
Or is it just Mitsuomi helping him? What bothers me is that why did we see mitsuomi tapping the window during his fight with madoka.

My personal opinion on this is that the first "tap" that Mitsuomi did might have knocked off Madoka's aim slightly. From there on out, Bob was on his own. I'm not even sure if that is the case - it could very well just have been an indication of Mitsuomi's personality - ie, that he is actually interested in the outcome of that fight, and possibly slightly nervous. I could go either way really.

pv82 · Post by **pv82** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 6:24 pm

So Mitsumi's motivations are still unknown??? I had a question which I think may have already be answered. It concerns the Tournament, Why Is mitsumi figting? Aren't all his guys going to graduate this year (year curent in the manga). Who is going to be a part of the enforcement group once they leave? Doesn't Maya graduate this year too.

Agent_Wax · Post by **Agent_Wax** » Wed Jun 16, 2004 9:44 pm

So Mitsumi's motivations are still unknown??? I had a question which I think may have already be answered. It concerns the Tournament, Why Is mitsumi figting? Aren't all his guys going to graduate this year (year curent in the manga). Who is going to be a part of the enforcement group once they leave? Doesn't Maya graduate this year too.

I don't think all of the enforcement group is necessarily in the senior year. Some may be younger. And anyway, it really wouldn't matter much. Mitsuomi just needs one more 'Feather' to complete his dream before he dies. The school is just a testing ground to select martial artists for 'the real world'.

Fugu wrote:

My personal opinion on this is that the first "tap" that Mitsuomi did might have knocked off Madoka's aim slightly.

Huh. And I thought he just placed his fingers there for no particular reason...

User151 · Post by **User151** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 1:00 am

pv82 wrote:So Mitsumi's motivations are still unknown??? I had a question which I think may have already be answered. It concerns the Tournament, Why Is mitsumi figting? Aren't all his guys going to graduate this year (year curent in the manga). Who is going to be a part of the enforcement group once they leave? Doesn't Maya graduate this year too.

Maybe because he's the current leader of the enforcement group?
Remember in the fight with Shin & Mitsuomi, Shin was the leader of the enforcement group.

And for Maya, yes, she would graduate this year but she's fighting to stop Mitsuomi from following the path of Shin. (Mana told her before she died)

chumsy · Post by **chumsy** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 6:41 am

Shin was the leader of the enforcement group.

actually shin created the junkenyenbu sorry for the spelling. mitsuomi created the enforcement group

so ya where do they go after they graduate? a fighting paradise in college maybe

Post by **FuguTabetai** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 7:52 am

I should point out the the Shikkoubu ("Enforcement Group") is a title for the particular group that wins the tournament. So Mitsuomi definitely did not create the Enforcement group - he was just in the group that won it in the past arc.

If, for example, the Jyuukenbu wins the tournament this year, they become the next Enforcement Group.

chumsy · Post by **chumsy** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 4:51 pm

oh thanks for that clear up

TopHat · Post by **TopHat** » Thu Jun 17, 2004 9:29 pm

But, on the other hand, if Bob realize that all improvements that he got now are because of the foundations that Maya had given him, he might not join Mitsuomi.

I don't think that Natsume's training would have any bearing on his decision. Remember after Isuzu showed up, Bob asked her something about why they just watched him dragging that weight around all the time - meaning, why watch when Mitsuomi knew perfectly well that Maya was completely mistaken in Bob's training. Bob just discovered that all his work since he joined the Jyuukenbu has basically been a total waste (or just a damn near-total waste) since his body was physically the strongest of the group to begin with.

Now that he's discovered the connection between fighting and dancing, he's going to become extremely powerful extremely fast no matter what anyone tries to teach him, and he has only himself to thank - I don't think he's going to have any sort of gratitude to the Enforcement Group because first of all - Chiaki - and second of all, they never told him anything to help him - they're still enemies.

Though he owes Isuzu for helping him out right then, but that's really no big deal.

So even though Natsume didn't make him stronger, he's still got loyalties to all his other club members. They're his comrades, friends. He probably wouldn't give that up for some hazy promise of strength, not after all that's happened.[/i]

User151 · Post by **User151** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:39 am

Yes, Maya didn't do anything to improve his strength but rather she's just making him run to improve his stamina. Remember, at the beginning of the story, she made him run alot to drain the tobaco(nicotine?) poison from him.

And Maya hasn't teach him anything yet, she's just building a solid foundation for him. She's trying to make Bob understand more important stuff than strength and techniques in fighting, for instance, the "1st Eye 2nd Feet..." saying. Because she knew that once solid foundations are set for him, he would shoot up to the top. I don't think she's wrong with her training.

And for the Enforcement group part, at the bowling alley, when Mitsuomi invite Bob to join, he was really thinking maybe what this guy says is right untill he was stopped by Chiaki. So he has a kinda both anger and respect(admiration) for Mitsuomi. He was also thinking lately that he was left behind whereas Souichiro is making alot of progress and he doesn't want to be left behind. In other words, he wants to catch up Souichiro(he wanna be strong) in a real short time. So if Mitsuomi can offer some sort of short cut for him to catch up Souichiro, i don't know, he might take it.

What Bob hasn't realized is that, without his powers, Souichiro is just a one little punk.

kujoe · Post by **kujoe** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 1:11 am

Well, if Bob didn't have his athletic gifts and superior physique, he'd just be a punk as well. I think Maya's philosophy was to improve on the strengths of each person, hence the different training methods she applied to Souichirou and Bob. Since the tournament is coming soon, (supposed to be, that is) she probably had to make do with the time they had left. Furthermore, Bob already practices capoiera even before he and Souichirou joined the Jyuukenbu.

User151 · Post by **User151** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 5:32 am

FuguTabetai wrote:I should point out the the Shikkoubu ("Enforcement Group") is a title for the particular group that wins the tournament. So Mitsuomi definitely did not create the Enforcement group - he was just in the group that won it in the past arc.

If, for example, the Jyuukenbu wins the tournament this year, they become the next Enforcement Group.

But why did Shin and Mitsuomi fight in an official tournament since Shin is a leader of Jyuukenbu and Jyuukenbu wins the tournament. So they don't really need to fight, right?

kujoe · Post by **kujoe** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 10:16 am

^That was for determining who would be the president if I'm not mistaken. As the results of the tournament show, Mitsuomi received that position. They didn't have much of a choice anyway.

MrProphet · Post by **MrProphet** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 10:32 am

I think we should differentiate between the old Jyuukenbu and the new Jyuukenbu. Here's the chronology:

1. Shin is the school president and leader of the then-Enforcers, who also form the Katana (I am guessing that Shin won the previous tournament with Katana-members).

2. Katana is broken up, so Shin forms Jyuukenbu with Mitsuomi, Maya, Asshat and Tawara. They win the Tournament and become the Enforcement group. Shin dies.

3. Maya splits from the Enforcers and forms the new Jyuukenbu with Masataka and Aya (plus Bob, Nagi, Asshat and Kurei later on). Mitsuomi apparently abandons the name Jyuukenbu for his group and it is henceforth referred to as the Enforcement Group.

So, technically, although the name is the same, it's a different Jyuukenbu (except for Maya and Asshat, I guess).

User151 · Post by **User151** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:35 pm

Yes but why does Shin and Mitsuomi have to fight face to face in an official tournament of the School. Jyuukenbu won the tournament and they're both members right?

pv82 · Post by **pv82** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 12:49 pm

Why?
Maya
To stop shin
Wanting to prove he was strong
Too many to pick

Mellow Yellow · Post by **Mellow Yellow** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 3:54 pm

Yeah, the fight between Shin and Mitsuomi had nothing to do with the school tournament. They fought for the reasons stated by pv82

User151 · Post by **User151** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 7:56 pm

But why it was held officially at the school?

MrProphet · Post by **MrProphet** » Fri Jun 18, 2004 9:27 pm

Because they are two of the school's head honchos?

Anyhow, Todou Gakuen is very structured as far as fighting is concerned, all the fights are very official and sanctioned, so it doesn't surprise me that a duel between Shin and Mitsuomi would be held this way.

After all, it was an honest duel to see who was stronger (and hence, who would "get" Maya). If one of them simply wanted to murder the other, it would have happened in a dark alley. But, both Shin and Mitsuomi want public recognition of their superiority other the looser, so it was held at a public venue.

User151 · Post by **User151** » Sat Jun 19, 2004 12:01 am

I see thanks for the explanation

Moobah · Post by **Moobah** » Sun Jun 20, 2004 10:29 pm

Wasn't the official fight... about ranking?

burrowowl · Post by **burrowowl** » Sun Jun 20, 2004 10:38 pm

Moobah wrote:Wasn't the official fight... about ranking?

The fight determines the ranking of individual fighters and their clubs. Some amount of prestige comes from being recognizes as a high-rank fighter (by law, mangaka are required to have all prominent characters look down upon all non-prominent characters' fighting prowess, regardless of rank). However, at the very top of the pile, the student goverment is headed by the club that won the last tournament; the Enforcement group.

As for the past story arc's version of who is strongest, Shin didn't participate the year before Mitsuomi matriculated; he let Bushichi do most of the fighting, just like Bunshichi let Mitsuomi do almost all of the fighting the year Shin died.

For all we know, Mitsuomi is going to end up teaming up with Jyukenbo again F in the upcoming tournament, but let Nagi, Bob, Aya, and Masataka do all the fighting. I rather doubt it, but it looks possible.

This is all being said with no insight about the conversation between Mitsuomi, Emi, and Tagami at the hospital in Chapter 75. I only know my hiragana, and have a very poor vocabulary.

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The future for Bob and Bunshichi

The future for Bob and Bunshichi

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