Character description

Tenjo Tenge: Where the boys are bad, and the girls are badder.

Moderator: FuguTabetai

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Wed Apr 06, 2005 9:01 am

kujoe wrote: I agree with Elite here--in the sense that opening multiple gates is perhaps not the main point, but is probably just indicative of something else entirely. Like for Nagi, it's due to his Dragon's Fist--so that's self-explanatory--whereas Kagiroi still has a huge question mark on top of his head.

.
The dragon fist doesn't let Nagi open multiple gates, but using the power of the Black Dragon, which he uses to open the gate to the dragon fist, see how the "gate" closed when his mom absorbed the dragon's power in vol 11.

User avatar
Dark_Harlequin
Tamashii
Tamashii
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 10:18 am
Location: Heidelberg /Germany

Post by Dark_Harlequin » Wed Apr 06, 2005 10:11 am

But he couls open tessen ishiumis gate. couldn't he? :wink:
Friends are the best thing that can happen to you ;).

Bunshichi Tawara is the best!

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Wed Apr 06, 2005 10:33 am

Dark_Harlequin wrote:But he couls open tessen ishiumis gate. couldn't he? :wink:
Everyone has that gate, including Nagi.

User avatar
kujoe
Sensei
Sensei
Posts: 661
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 7:41 am
Location: Vancouver, Canada

Post by kujoe » Thu Apr 07, 2005 1:17 am

kk1 wrote:The dragon fist doesn't let Nagi open multiple gates, but using the power of the Black Dragon, which he uses to open the gate to the dragon fist, see how the "gate" closed when his mom absorbed the dragon's power in vol 11.
Well, I'm not sure if that's the way to go about it, since Makiko seems to say otherwise. Then again, it seems that the Red Feathers require a special event, an extraordinary condition or special training of some sort in order to open their respective 8th Gates...

All I'm just saying is that the fact the Nagi has the Dragon's Fist also allows him to wield multiple Gates--hell, probably even beyond 8 Gates if he's able to use any 8th Gate that he was able to eat up previously. Moreover, even if a White Feather were to have 7 Gates open, he or she wouldn't have an 8th, unless some intermarrying with a Red Feather family occurred at one point.

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Thu Apr 07, 2005 2:25 am

kujoe wrote:
kk1 wrote:The dragon fist doesn't let Nagi open multiple gates, but using the power of the Black Dragon, which he uses to open the gate to the dragon fist, see how the "gate" closed when his mom absorbed the dragon's power in vol 11.
Well, I'm not sure if that's the way to go about it, since Makiko seems to say otherwise. Then again, it seems that the Red Feathers require a special event, an extraordinary condition or special training of some sort in order to open their respective 8th Gates...

All I'm just saying is that the fact the Nagi has the Dragon's Fist also allows him to wield multiple Gates--hell, probably even beyond 8 Gates if he's able to use any 8th Gate that he was able to eat up previously. Moreover, even if a White Feather were to have 7 Gates open, he or she wouldn't have an 8th, unless some intermarrying with a Red Feather family occurred at one point.
Well its just a theory based on what we've seen so far, we'll have to wait for more chapters to see who is right, I did use to think what you said was right but it just doesn't fit everything else.

User avatar
kujoe
Sensei
Sensei
Posts: 661
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 7:41 am
Location: Vancouver, Canada

Post by kujoe » Thu Apr 07, 2005 10:47 am

I'm not really arguing about whether or not Souichirou uses a dragon to open his Gate--I just simply commented on it. Who knows? You could be right, and it wouldn't be the first time I misunderstood something based on what I read.

However, what I was implying is the fact that he can steal, eat or munch up Gates in the first place also allows him to wield many as an indirect consequence. He could only end up opening an Earth Gate and the Nagi Gate for all we care, but he's also shown that he can use Ishiyumi's Water Gate after stealing it from him.

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Thu Apr 07, 2005 12:27 pm

kujoe wrote:I'm not really arguing about whether or not Souichirou uses a dragon to open his Gate--I just simply commented on it. Who knows? You could be right, and it wouldn't be the first time I misunderstood something based on what I read.

However, what I was implying is the fact that he can steal, eat or munch up Gates in the first place also allows him to wield many as an indirect consequence. He could only end up opening an Earth Gate and the Nagi Gate for all we care, but he's also shown that he can use Ishiyumi's Water Gate after stealing it from him.
Oh I know I'm not arguing, I was just saying after rereading it for the 1000th time I misunderstood the whole gates and dragons things. Whenever using an ability, it's referred to as opening a gate but whenever Nagi's power or how a gate is open is referred to it's talked about in terms of dragons. So Kabuto said "the black dragon ate the water dragon" not the water gate, Isshiyumi "my dragon, I will take it back" not gate. So it just seemed to me the gates are permanent, the dragons aren't. Nagi's dragon , the black, can eat the other dragons. Remeber Makiko in vol 9 said the "dragons" live in everyone, so if Nagi's dragon eats that dragon you obviously would lose the ability to open that dragons gate. She said each 8th family has a unique gate but not a dragon, so far only the black dragon has been mentioned as different from the usual 7 and that is unique to the Nagi family(which Makiko said gets its power from dragons). From rereading the past arc the Dragon's eye power comes from being able to tap the ki of every person on Earth and none of the others power source has been described except for the resonance of other red feathers. So maybe that's why it took Nagi's mom absorbing all that power 8 years ago to awaken the red feather powers and why Nagi's dad has him absorbing all that power now, only a Nagi can absorb enough power to open other red feathers gates.

User avatar
MrProphet
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 939
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2004 6:11 pm
Location: Tallinn, Estonia

Post by MrProphet » Thu Apr 07, 2005 1:49 pm

I think it was implied several times that "dragon", "demon" and "gate" are the same thing.

When Ishiyumi says that his dragon is weeping, he is being metaphoric. That is, Nagi stole his ability to open the water gate, but Ishiyumi's knowledge of how to do it still remains in his memory. Thus, even though he knows how to do it, he is unable and that frustrates him. Thus, the "weeping dragon" metaphor.

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Thu Apr 07, 2005 11:32 pm

MrProphet wrote:I think it was implied several times that "dragon", "demon" and "gate" are the same thing.

.
Where?

User avatar
kujoe
Sensei
Sensei
Posts: 661
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 7:41 am
Location: Vancouver, Canada

Post by kujoe » Thu Apr 07, 2005 11:55 pm

kk1 wrote: Oh I know I'm not arguing, I was just saying after rereading it for the 1000th time I misunderstood the whole gates and dragons things.
Uhm, what MrProphet said.^

One can probably try to define each of those terms in their proper context from the manga, as Fugu has done before, but for the sake of discussion I think it's best that they be referred to as the same thing--more or less. Unless one qualifies their usage. (I find it confusing when I'm talking about it from the top of my head, so in this case, let me restate myself with the use of the term "Dragon" as opposed to "Gate.")

Pardon me for being blunt--it's up to you how you prefer to interpret how Red Feathers and Gate users open their Gates and what not, since the manga is still in a long way from explaining itself word for word.

But I was trying to imply that Nagi can "use multiple gates" (or Dragons, whatever..) because he has the ability, not only to "eat up" the Dragons of his enemies, but also steal to them. Thus, Nagi all of a sudden shoots water bullets like a pro--and through the use of his blood even.

Now, Kagiroi seems to be able to "wield multiple Gates" as well, but we don't know how he does it. Does he have a Dragon's Fist? Is he the Nagi Clan's long-lost prodigal bastard? (A stupid plot twist in my opinion..) We don't know.

User avatar
MrProphet
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 939
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2004 6:11 pm
Location: Tallinn, Estonia

Post by MrProphet » Fri Apr 08, 2005 1:48 am

kk1 wrote:
MrProphet wrote:I think it was implied several times that "dragon", "demon" and "gate" are the same thing.

.
Where?
In the manga, you know.

"Dragon" is always used as a short-form for "dragon gate", while "demon" is referred to several times in the same context as "dragon", especially by Makiko.

User avatar
FuguTabetai
Shifu
Shifu
Posts: 2587
Joined: Mon Feb 10, 2003 5:45 pm
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Contact:

Post by FuguTabetai » Fri Apr 08, 2005 7:14 am

"Dragon", "Dragon Gate", "Gate", and "Chakra" are all used pretty much synonomously. "Demon" isn't used as much, but I think it also means about the same thing, except that the wielders are, in someone's opinon, "evil".

User avatar
Dark_Harlequin
Tamashii
Tamashii
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 10:18 am
Location: Heidelberg /Germany

Post by Dark_Harlequin » Fri Apr 08, 2005 8:02 am

Mitsuomi also tells us in Volume 4.

He says "there are Dragons, demons, Gods.... There are many names for them". 8)
Friends are the best thing that can happen to you ;).

Bunshichi Tawara is the best!

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Fri Apr 08, 2005 12:34 pm

MrProphet wrote:
kk1 wrote:
MrProphet wrote:I think it was implied several times that "dragon", "demon" and "gate" are the same thing.

.
Where?
In the manga, you know.

"Dragon" is always used as a short-form for "dragon gate", while "demon" is referred to several times in the same context as "dragon", especially by Makiko.
No, duhhh I stuupit duhhh, :roll: no shit in the manga where specifically, volume, chapter page?
That was my point I thought they were used interchangably too but in rereading it they're not.

User avatar
MrProphet
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 939
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2004 6:11 pm
Location: Tallinn, Estonia

Post by MrProphet » Fri Apr 08, 2005 7:06 pm

This is all from Volumes 8-10
Bubble 0 Character: Nagi Makiko
* (English by fugu) The source of the demon exorcists' power are dragons
Bubble 2 Character: Nagi Makiko
* (English by fugu) The Gate the Dragon leaves through
* (English by fugu) The Dragon's Gate
Bubble 9 Character: Person
* (English by fugu) The demon exorcist family
* (English by fugu) is a family that becomes demons in order to destroy demons !!
Bubble 0 Character: Nagi Makiko
* (English by fugu) The so-called "7 dragons" that live within everyone and govern the powers of Wood, Fire, Metal, Water, Wind and Air
Bubble 0 Character: Person
* (English by fugu) The "Earth" Gate
* (English by fugu) The source of it all, and the first Dragon
Bubble 6 Character: Nagi Makiko
* (English by fugu) The Dragon Demon was just getting a hold of his left leg ...

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Sat Apr 09, 2005 3:18 am



User avatar
MrProphet
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 939
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2004 6:11 pm
Location: Tallinn, Estonia

Post by MrProphet » Sat Apr 09, 2005 4:06 am

You are just nitpicking.

When they say "dragon", they mean the personification of the "dragon gate" in the form of that thing that swirls around Nagi when he opens his gate.

That "thing" does not really appear. It's just a graphical representation of Oh!Great's trying to show that "the gate is open". There is no other way to show such metaphysical things.

Nowhere does it say of is implied that "dragon" and "dragon gate" are two distinct things...

User avatar
FuguTabetai
Shifu
Shifu
Posts: 2587
Joined: Mon Feb 10, 2003 5:45 pm
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Contact:

Post by FuguTabetai » Sat Apr 09, 2005 8:25 am



User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Sat Apr 09, 2005 12:09 pm



User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Sat Apr 09, 2005 12:13 pm

MrProphet wrote:You are just nitpicking.

When they say "dragon", they mean the personification of the "dragon gate" in the form of that thing that swirls around Nagi when he opens his gate.

That "thing" does not really appear. It's just a graphical representation of Oh!Great's trying to show that "the gate is open". There is no other way to show such metaphysical things.

Nowhere does it say of is implied that "dragon" and "dragon gate" are two distinct things...
Am I? So a gate "ate" Makiko's eye?

User avatar
MrProphet
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 939
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2004 6:11 pm
Location: Tallinn, Estonia

Post by MrProphet » Sat Apr 09, 2005 6:36 pm

That is correct. The misuse of the chakra and the power of the gate getting out of control.

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Sun Apr 10, 2005 1:11 am

MrProphet wrote:That is correct. The misuse of the chakra and the power of the gate getting out of control.
Hmm I seem to remeber her saying a dragon did that, but I guess you wouldn't want to use a direct quote to back up your view now would you? It also sure doesn't look like a gate under her patch, kinda looks like oh I don't know maybe a dragon? and since she's a Nagi isn't her gate in her fist? Hmmm.

User avatar
MrProphet
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 939
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2004 6:11 pm
Location: Tallinn, Estonia

Post by MrProphet » Sun Apr 10, 2005 1:28 am

You do understand the meaning of the word "metaphor", don't you, kk1? You have perhaps noticed that the word "dragon" is used inside quotation marks?

If you read chapter 53 where Makiko is explaining the Dragon Gates, you will notice that she says that the "dragons" that devoured her eye. That sentence is preceded by the discussion of how the 7 "dragons" are the gates of chakra, with each governing a specific power, and that each gate is opened when the "dragon" is fed enough ki.

There are even arrows pointing from each "dragon" to a specific gate. How much more obvious can it get that "dragon" equals "dragon gate" in meaning?

EliteF22
Senpai
Senpai
Posts: 333
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 5:16 pm

Post by EliteF22 » Sun Apr 10, 2005 4:32 am

Uh, I've got to disagree with you on this Mr. Prophet. The chapter appears to state quite clearly that dragon's and dragon gates are not the same thing.

Direct Qoute:
"It is different for different people. For some, it is through the study of martial arts, or others meditation, or thought, or emotions, but once the "dragons" have devoured enough "energy" to be invoked, the gate is opened for the first time and a "power" is born."

The dragon's already exist within everybody. Only when a person has enough energy the gate giving access to that dragon is opened. I don't know how you could say that the dragon is opened for the first time, it just doesn't sound right. How do you open a dragon? Opening a gate makes more sense.

User avatar
Dark_Harlequin
Tamashii
Tamashii
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 10:18 am
Location: Heidelberg /Germany

Post by Dark_Harlequin » Sun Apr 10, 2005 6:08 am

Dragons and dragon's gates are NOT the sae thing. But nearly. for my understandig the Dragon is the potential of using a certain ability. The Dragon's gate is the way of chaneling or using this ability :)
Friends are the best thing that can happen to you ;).

Bunshichi Tawara is the best!

User avatar
kujoe
Sensei
Sensei
Posts: 661
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 7:41 am
Location: Vancouver, Canada

Post by kujoe » Sun Apr 10, 2005 8:03 am

I read the "dragons" as more of a personification of the Gates themselves. In terms of intent, power, potential and movement--there are such things as "dragons" and they are different from Gates. Like it says in the manga, when "the dragon is fed, a gate is opened for the first time..." which is either plain rhetoric or plain, literal truth. And yet, when Nagi's ability allows him to steal the Dragons of others--to "eat them up"--it becomes his, and the Gates of his enemies are either closed or no more. They are very connected.

I just find it weird that "dragon" is something that one summons--like some otherwordly being from another world. Are there many Dragons that exist then--in the same sense that animals exist in this world? Or is it something innate, a personified form of some cursed power coming from the chakra that is unlocked within the body? Or is it the personification of chi itself that flows around the world? Like Makiko has said before, everything are simply parts of each other.

The rhetoric used seems to suggest the first, while being ambiguous at the same time to suggest the latter two.

User avatar
MrProphet
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 939
Joined: Tue Apr 20, 2004 6:11 pm
Location: Tallinn, Estonia

Post by MrProphet » Sun Apr 10, 2005 2:41 pm

EliteF22 wrote:Uh, I've got to disagree with you on this Mr. Prophet. The chapter appears to state quite clearly that dragon's and dragon gates are not the same thing.
Really? And you also think that Nagi actually eats the dragons he steals? Chomp-chomp... 8) Or that the Takayanagi Phoenix is the actual firebird? 8)

Oh!great is not a literal author, he uses hyperbolae and metaphors to get his meaning across. To make us undrestand the meaning of dragon gates, he uses the metaphor of a "dragon eating energy". It's in quotations, for God's sake, that should be a total giveaway as to the fact that he is poetic, not literal.

User avatar
Dark_Harlequin
Tamashii
Tamashii
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 10:18 am
Location: Heidelberg /Germany

Post by Dark_Harlequin » Sun Apr 10, 2005 3:49 pm

To interrupt this more or less never ending discussion about The Exorcism Fist I'll do Mataza now. :)

Mataza Tsumuji

Image
Name: Mataza Tsumuji
Nickname: None
Fighting style: The octuple spear of the Tsumuji and his fighting style full of hatred with the Dragon Claws
Supernatural abilitys: Dragon Claws
Current Position: Mataza is ( or was until the fight with Soichiro) the current leader of the Tsumuji house, he is a member of F, his school grade is not known
Age: 16
Family: Father Yohira, Mother ( name unknown) from a side house of the red feathers, half brothe Yorimasa
About Mataza: Mataza was given back to his father by his mother who did't have the money to raise him. There he was treated so badly by his half brother Yorimasa that he one day freaked out and his dreagon claws awoke and crippled his half brother Yorimasa. Later when Mitsuomi took controll over the Takayanagi house, he badly injured his father, burned the eight traditional spear bearers of the Tsumuji famaly as they refused to serve him and took the eight spears for himself.
Mataza pretends to hate the red feathers and the traditional way of his father but, as it later becomes obvious, he was just searching for the love he never got from his father.
He seems to be blind on his right eye.

Correction? Please tell me ;)
Last edited by Dark_Harlequin on Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:06 am, edited 2 times in total.
Friends are the best thing that can happen to you ;).

Bunshichi Tawara is the best!

User avatar
Dark_Harlequin
Tamashii
Tamashii
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 10:18 am
Location: Heidelberg /Germany

Post by Dark_Harlequin » Sun Apr 10, 2005 3:59 pm

Katsumi Kabuto

Image
Name: Katsumi Kabuto
Nickname: None
fighting style: ??? (unknown)
Supernatural Abilitys: ??? (unknown)
Current position: He is a member of F, school grade and family position is unknown at this moment
Age: ??? (unknown)
Family: Father (name unknown) the big guy of the 12 godly generals of Takayanagi. ( on the right of 8 in Volume 9)
About Kabuto: Not much is known about this misterious member of F. He seems to be the leader behind many actions of F and he seems to avoid open combat wherefore his abilitys and fighting style are not known. He uses to order the other members of F arround, only to Sohaku he is humble. he runs from sohaku after leting him down with the chip of the emi familie.
Last edited by Dark_Harlequin on Mon Apr 11, 2005 11:27 am, edited 2 times in total.
Friends are the best thing that can happen to you ;).

Bunshichi Tawara is the best!

User avatar
Dark_Harlequin
Tamashii
Tamashii
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 10:18 am
Location: Heidelberg /Germany

Post by Dark_Harlequin » Sun Apr 10, 2005 4:09 pm

@ Fugu Comments on the character list ( after reading it thorougly): :)

Good work. just some small corrections:
1 ) Ishimatsu was no killed. Just badly injured.
2 ) Bunshichis pope runs a rice shop where Bunshichi sometimes helps. just to have something for this character :wink:

And thanks for correcting the stuff in my texts :D
Friends are the best thing that can happen to you ;).

Bunshichi Tawara is the best!

EliteF22
Senpai
Senpai
Posts: 333
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2004 5:16 pm

Post by EliteF22 » Sun Apr 10, 2005 4:10 pm

Correction Kabuto is one of the 12 founding families. I thought his name was Katsumi? Anyways, he is the ( or is that was ) head of the family. Kabuto family members act as the role of commander. May have been killed by Ishiyumi.

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Sun Apr 10, 2005 11:57 pm

MrProphet wrote:You do understand the meaning of the word "metaphor", don't you, kk1? You have perhaps noticed that the word "dragon" is used inside quotation marks?

If you read chapter 53 where Makiko is explaining the Dragon Gates, you will notice that she says that the "dragons" that devoured her eye. That sentence is preceded by the discussion of how the 7 "dragons" are the gates of chakra, with each governing a specific power, and that each gate is opened when the "dragon" is fed enough ki.

There are even arrows pointing from each "dragon" to a specific gate. How much more obvious can it get that "dragon" equals "dragon gate" in meaning?
Uhh yeah, I've heard of them :roll: and it's in quotation marks because it's not literally a dragon of Japanese mythology that's just what they call it because that's the closest word they have for it. And that's quoted above and it does not say the "7 dragons are the gates of chakra", why make something up? Uhh those arrows are pointing from their names to pictures of dragons.

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Mon Apr 11, 2005 12:11 am

MrProphet wrote:
EliteF22 wrote:Uh, I've got to disagree with you on this Mr. Prophet. The chapter appears to state quite clearly that dragon's and dragon gates are not the same thing.
Really? And you also think that Nagi actually eats the dragons he steals? Chomp-chomp... 8) Or that the Takayanagi Phoenix is the actual firebird? 8)

Oh!great is not a literal author, he uses hyperbolae and metaphors to get his meaning across. To make us undrestand the meaning of dragon gates, he uses the metaphor of a "dragon eating energy". It's in quotations, for God's sake, that should be a total giveaway as to the fact that he is poetic, not literal.
No one ever said Nagi himself "eats" them, Kabuto once said the Black dragon ate the water dragon. How is the Takayanagi crest a metaphor? It's a family crest. Uhmm and our argument was that dragons and gates are seperate entities whatever they are, not whether they are being referred to metaphorically, since they obviously are. We all know the dragon fist gate on Nagi's fist isn't a hinged object with a little key that opens by pushing it. :roll:

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Mon Apr 11, 2005 12:31 am

Dark_Harlequin wrote:To interrupt this more or less never ending discussion about The Exorcism Fist I'll do Mataza now. :)

Mataza Tsumuji

Name: Mataza Tsumuji
Nickname: None
Fighting style: The octuple spear of the Tsumuji and his fighting style full of hatred with the Dragon Claws
Supernatural abilitys: Dragon Claws
Current Position: Mataza is ( or was until the fight with Soichiro) the current leader of the Tsumuji house, he is a member of F, his school grade is not known
Age: 16
Family: Father Yohira, Mother ( name unknown) from a side house of the red feathers, half brothe Yorimasa
About Mataza: Mataza was given away to the Tsumuji ouse by his mother who did't have the money to raise him. There he was treated so badly by his half brother Yorimasa that he one day freaked out and his dreagon claws awoke and crippled his half brother Yorimasa. Later when Mitsuomi took controll over the Takayanagi house, he badly injured his father, burned the eight traditional spear bearers of the Tsumuji famaly as they refused to serve him and took the eight spears for himself.
Mataza pretends to hate the red feathers and the traditional way of his father but, as it later becomes obvious, he was just searching for the love he never got from his father.

Correction? Please tell me ;)
Wasn't given to the Tsumuji house his mother just brought him back to his father because she was so poor she had to prostitute herself to make money(it's never implied she just dropped him off and left). And his power awoke not from "freaking out" but when he tried to kill his brother his father stopped him and broke the spear he was using, a shard of which went through his eye puncturing his brain. This injury awakened his power. As Dougen told his father it's a very rare way for a power to awaken but it does happen.
His mother is from the Shyukyou branch of the Kabane family.

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Mon Apr 11, 2005 12:51 am

Dark_Harlequin wrote: Kabuto Katsuyoshi

Name: Kabuto Katsuyoshi
Nickname: None
fighting style: ??? (unknown)
Supernatural Abilitys: ??? (unknown)
Current position: He is a member of F, school grade and family position is unknown at this moment
Age: ??? (unknown)
Family: ??? (unknown) but his family is not one of the 12 pheonixes of Takayanagi
About Kabuto: Not much is known about this misterious member of F. He seems to be the leader behind many actions of F and he seems to avoid open combat wherefore his abilitys and fighting style are not known. He uses to order the other members of F arround, only to Sohaku he is humble.
According to the UJ special his name is Katsumi and is the so called leader of the 6 white feathers families managing them.
Fled Souhaku after angering him because he couldn't get the chip from the Jyukenbu.

User avatar
Dark_Harlequin
Tamashii
Tamashii
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 10:18 am
Location: Heidelberg /Germany

Post by Dark_Harlequin » Mon Apr 11, 2005 10:31 am

@kk1 I didn't say that Yohira wasn't his father but his mother did give him to the Tsumuji house ( because Yohira was Matazas Father)
Friends are the best thing that can happen to you ;).

Bunshichi Tawara is the best!

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Mon Apr 11, 2005 11:53 am

Dark_Harlequin wrote:@kk1 I didn't say that Yohira wasn't his father but his mother did give him to the Tsumuji house ( because Yohira was Matazas Father)
:?: I didn't say you did :? And his mother did bring him back but I was just pointing out it's never explicitly stated she gave him to the Tsumuji house. Fugu wants facts in the character despcritptions not conjecture.

Anyway you could add blind in right eye to his description.

User avatar
Dark_Harlequin
Tamashii
Tamashii
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 10:18 am
Location: Heidelberg /Germany

Post by Dark_Harlequin » Tue Apr 12, 2005 1:55 am

kk1 wrote:
Dark_Harlequin wrote:@kk1 I didn't say that Yohira wasn't his father but his mother did give him to the Tsumuji house ( because Yohira was Matazas Father)
:?: I didn't say you did :? And his mother did bring him back but I was just pointing out it's never explicitly stated she gave him to the Tsumuji house. Fugu wants facts in the character despcritptions not conjecture.
Ok. I got that wrong. Sorry. :)
kk1 wrote: Anyway you could add blind in right eye to his description.
Realy is he? :?: Where is it sayed?
Friends are the best thing that can happen to you ;).

Bunshichi Tawara is the best!

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Tue Apr 12, 2005 8:38 am

Dark_Harlequin wrote:
kk1 wrote: Anyway you could add blind in right eye to his description.
Realy is he? :?: Where is it sayed?
When that shard of spear went through his eye to his brain, didn't you notice his right eye is always covered, by his hat, by his hair, just look at his fight with Nagi, his right eye is only shown once and he has a scar right through his iris.

User avatar
FuguTabetai
Shifu
Shifu
Posts: 2587
Joined: Mon Feb 10, 2003 5:45 pm
Location: Tokyo, Japan
Contact:

Post by FuguTabetai » Wed Apr 13, 2005 8:16 am

Thanks for the write-ups of Tsumuji Mataza and Kabuto Katsumi (although I still have him as Katsuyoshi as he was called that once in volume 12 I think. I think Katsumi is a girl's name, but should probably change it since that is what is in the UJ special.)

The only characters left really are:

Tsumuji Mataza Yorihira (I just have the stuff from the UJ special about the Tsumuji family in there for him.)

Inue Noriko Shindayuu

Enmi Enma

Kago Souhaku Jyouun

Kamura Shidzuru

Hayabusa Brother

Kagiroi Tetsuhito (F)

Tsumuji Mataza Yorimasa

Tsumuji Mataza Yorihira's Uncle

I could use better information on:

Nagi Makiko

anyway, thanks for all the help. I think the character list is now a very useful reference.

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Wed Apr 13, 2005 11:50 am

FuguTabetai wrote:Thanks for the write-ups of Tsumuji Mataza and Kabuto Katsumi (although I still have him as Katsuyoshi as he was called that once in volume 12 I think. I think Katsumi is a girl's name, but should probably change it since that is what is in the UJ special.)

.
It can be a boy's name too. In your translation (p161)and in the EG scanlation I have when he introduces himself in Vol 12 it's Katsumi too. And Madoka's nickname for him is Kaburin.

User avatar
zangetsu
Tamashii
Tamashii
Posts: 41
Joined: Fri Jul 30, 2004 11:33 am

Post by zangetsu » Wed Apr 13, 2005 1:54 pm

Heh, Kabuto's such a wimp. I wonder if he even had a dragon for Nagi to steal.

Anyway, dosen't he also have some unamend siblings somewhere? I remeber he was called the oldest or youngest son.
Image

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Thu Apr 14, 2005 12:51 am

I'll try one.


Kago Souhaku

Image


Name: Kago Souhaku Jyouun
Nickname: None
fighting style: ??? (unknown)
Supernatural Abilitys: Can control other people(and increase their power) through a small round charm, unknown if this is a red feather power or another ability
Current position: Head of F, Current leader of the red feather Kago family
Age: ??? (unknown)
Family: Son: Nagi Souichiro, Ex-wife: Nagi Makiko
About Souhaku: The mysterious head of "F", which he founded 8 years ago. Thus far his motivations and plans are still mostly unknown. He abandoned his wife Makiko after cutting off her right arm 8 years ago. Ally and backer of Mitsuomi during his coup d'etat 2 years ago, seem to have had a falling out recently.
A preist of some sort (possibly an Onmyou mystic, uses shikigami) , his family has an important position among the 12 families, they have the inheritance of "seirei" (holy or dead spirits). Lost the tips of his fingers on right hand when Masataka broke charm he was contolling Fuchien with.
Uses a large sword carried by Tetsuhito.

User avatar
Dark_Harlequin
Tamashii
Tamashii
Posts: 57
Joined: Sun Mar 27, 2005 10:18 am
Location: Heidelberg /Germany

Post by Dark_Harlequin » Thu Apr 14, 2005 9:09 am

Hey kk1. we are listet as the team who did Mataza.- ;)
Friends are the best thing that can happen to you ;).

Bunshichi Tawara is the best!

User avatar
Ryugan
Yuurei
Yuurei
Posts: 12
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:23 am

Post by Ryugan » Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:54 am

Heh, Kabuto's such a wimp. I wonder if he even had a dragon for Nagi to steal.

Anyway, dosen't he also have some unamend siblings somewhere? I remeber he was called the oldest or youngest son
All people have dragon gates, so technically nagi would have stolen his no matter how weak it was, assuming he used dragon's fist.

Remember wad mtaza did to his half brother? Kabuto probably did that to his siblings :twisted:
天 ã￾®ä¸‹ 天 ã￾®ä¸Š , 唯 一 人 我 ã￾‚ ã‚Š, 一 人 ã￾® ã￾¿ å°Š ã￾—

User avatar
Ryugan
Yuurei
Yuurei
Posts: 12
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:23 am

Post by Ryugan » Fri Apr 15, 2005 10:44 am

The concept of dragons and dragon gates would, i think, be quite hard to grasp by most westerners (no offense, its a culture thing, not intelligence). Oh great, like so many other manga authors, derive the concept of fighting with ki from chinese medicinal and literary concepts. Dragons are used to describe the flow or existence of internal life energy, ki, of humans in tt. As dictated by chinese martial arts , fighting abitlity can be augmented by this ki, through learning how to control its flow. E.g. i can focus most of my ki into my fist and hence my punch is stronger. In pugilist stories, fighters take this one step further. They can focus their ki through fixed meridian points (like a blood vessel network, only ki flows in place of blood) to activate certain abilities or techniques. Dragon gates are like these points. "When the dragon has devoured enough energy, the gate opens". Literally "when enough ki is focused through the correct meridian points, [ability/skill] can be used". The concept is similar to that of nuclear fusion bombs. Enough energy must be supplied to synergize a reaction that gives energy vastly greater than the original amount supplied. Oh great uses the dragon metaphor, i think, to make understanding this concept easier or just so it sounds cooler. It's actually much more complex, especially how the dragon fist works, so i won't go so much into detail.
天 ã￾®ä¸‹ 天 ã￾®ä¸Š , 唯 一 人 我 ã￾‚ ã‚Š, 一 人 ã￾® ã￾¿ å°Š ã￾—

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Fri Apr 15, 2005 1:50 pm

I think Oh Great explains it pretty well when he talks solely in terms of "ki", it's because he uses dragons and gates as metaphors that confuse everything. I think it was way back in volume 4 that Mitsuomi explained why Nagi has unlimited "ki", he can use the "ki" "of the trees and the sky and so on outside of people", But then Oh Great! had Makiko explain everything with colored dragons and gates and the Black dragon, etc. I think just about everyone gets the "ki" concepts(since I think just about every power has been explained with how "ki" is used), just not the dragons and gates stuff.
For those curious about the "ki" explanations Madoka explained Inue's power in vol 13.
As mentioned Nagi by Mitsuomi in vol 4.
The electricity from the earth gate by Fuchien and Emi in vol 7
The dragons pupil vol 10 by Kabuto abd The Dragon eye is somewhere but I can't find it at the moment.

User avatar
Ryugan
Yuurei
Yuurei
Posts: 12
Joined: Fri Apr 15, 2005 9:23 am

Post by Ryugan » Fri Apr 15, 2005 8:02 pm

The dragons pupil vol 10 by Kabuto abd The Dragon eye is somewhere but I can't find it at the moment.
Wad is the dragon pupil?
天 ã￾®ä¸‹ 天 ã￾®ä¸Š , 唯 一 人 我 ã￾‚ ã‚Š, 一 人 ã￾® ã￾¿ å°Š ã￾—

User avatar
kk1
Bushi
Bushi
Posts: 1138
Joined: Fri Dec 10, 2004 2:34 am

Post by kk1 » Fri Apr 15, 2005 11:17 pm

Ryugan wrote:
The dragons pupil vol 10 by Kabuto abd The Dragon eye is somewhere but I can't find it at the moment.
Wad is the dragon pupil?
Enmi Mouki's power.

User avatar
kujoe
Sensei
Sensei
Posts: 661
Joined: Mon Jun 23, 2003 7:41 am
Location: Vancouver, Canada

Post by kujoe » Sat Apr 16, 2005 10:52 am

It allows the user to make his or her enemies see illusions--very real-looking illusions. And though that may seem like a lame ability, it still has its uses.

Post Reply